Religion to Reality

Formation – From Lived Experience to Practical Application
Episode Overview
In this episode of Religion to Reality, hosts Dave Plisky and Father John Gribowich explore the critical topic of faith formation, examining the barriers that prevent Catholics from receiving ongoing spiritual development and highlighting practices that have proven successful. Through conversations with three experienced formation leaders, they uncover why trust and personal relationships are foundational to authentic spiritual growth.
Key Timestamps

[00:00:00] Opening quote on ministry and intimacy
[00:01:00] Introduction to faith formation experiences
[00:03:00] The backwards approach done right: Belong → Believe → Behave
[00:05:00] Results from discipleship study on formation needs
[00:06:00] Interview with Dr. Bill Keimig begins
[00:11:00] Discussion on trust in formation relationships
[00:19:00] Interview with Cindy Black on pastoral formation
[00:26:00] Consumer Christianity vs. authentic discipleship
[00:33:00] Interview with Friar Rick on Alpha program
[00:39:00] Practical ministry approaches and flexibility
[00:45:00] Long-term perspective on spiritual growth

Featured Guests
Dr. Bill Keimig
Deputy Director, Catechetical Institute at Franciscan University

Expert in RCIA/OCIA processes
Trainer for over 80 dioceses worldwide
Advocate for relationship-centered formation

Cindy Black
Pastoral Associate, St. Vincent de Paul Parish

Diocese of Fort Wayne-South Bend, Indiana
Experienced in Catholic radio ministry
Specialist in welcoming seekers to the Church

Friar Rick Riccioli
Parish Ministry Leader

Experienced with Alpha program implementation
Focus on hospitality and evangelization culture
Expert in community outreach through arts and media

Key Insights & Quotes
On Trust in Formation

“Ministry is defined by degree of intimacy and nothing else.” – Dr. Bill Keimig

On Consumer Christianity

“The end of evangelization is for you to go out and do it – to radically love people, not have the next thing that you get something out of.” – Cindy Black

On Personal Conversion

“Formation aims at the soul for yearning, while education aims at the mind for learning.” – Dr. Bill Keimig

On Authentic Discipleship

“The opposite of faith is not doubt, but the opposite of faith is certainty.” – Father John (quoting Anne Lamott)

Main Takeaways

Trust is Foundational: Authentic formation requires proving you’re trustworthy and demonstrating trust in God through daily interactions.

Relationship Before Program: Personal conversion happens through intimate relationships, not programmatic approaches that prioritize calendar schedules over individual needs.

Belong → Believe → Behave: The most effective formation welcomes people into community first, allowing belief and behavior to follow naturally.

Formation vs. Education: Formation targets the soul and develops yearning for God, while education primarily addresses intellectual understanding.

Avoiding Consumer Mentality: True discipleship involves giving what you’ve received rather than constantly seeking…

Prayer as Attention: Discovering the Mystical in Daily Life 
Quick Summary 
What if prayer isn’t just something you do at scheduled times, but the very attention you give to everything around you? In this transformative episode, we explore how “attention taken to its highest degree is the same thing as prayer” and discover why everyone—from busy parents to spiritual seekers—is called to be a mystic in their unique circumstances.
In this Episode, We Explore:

Why 43% of prayer app users aren’t even Catholic (and what this reveals about spiritual hunger)
The one simple test to know if your spiritual foundation is strong enough for growth
How to turn off notifications strategically to create sacred space in daily life
Why letting go of prayer aids might be essential for a deeper relationship with God

Redefining Prayer with Kathy Lorentz
Spiritual Director & Educator, Sunday to Sunday Ministry

“Let us remember that we are in the holy presence of God, and for me that is everything” (8:30) – How awareness of God’s constant presence transforms everything into prayer
“Attention is like a spotlight that can only focus on one thing at a time” (13:00) – The neuroscience behind why multitasking sabotages spiritual growth
Practical digital boundaries: Why Kathy keeps her phone on “do not disturb” and how to create notification-free zones (15:00)
Teaching teenagers mindfulness: The two-week digital journal exercise that helps students discover their own habits (14:30)

Digital Faith with Monica Martinez
Parish Lead at Hallow Prayer App

43% of Hallow users aren’t Catholic (22:30) – What this surprising statistic reveals about modern spiritual searching
“The Holy Spirit is not limited by an app” (23:45) – How technology creates safe spaces for spiritual curiosity
The trainer analogy: Why spiritual apps are like fitness trainers – helpful but not essential (24:00)
When prayer aids become idols: The hidden danger of relationship with your streak vs. relationship with God (26:30)

Universal Mysticism with Father David Roman
Pastor, St. Thomas Aquinas Parish, Fairfield, CT

Why everyone is called to be a mystic (32:30) – The same grace that worked in St. Teresa of Avila is available to every parent, professional, and person
“Formation vs. evangelizat…

How to Stop Compartmentalizing Your Faith Life and Start Living an Integrated Life

Listen to the trailer for the Religion to Reality podcast, where we help you live a more integrated life.